Lenin said: Aaaaawwwwww!!! I wonder why there are some people who hate this couple
Because they're heartless bastards :)
Saber, well, she would travel back in time. Rin, she can get anyone she wants. Poor Sakura chan is the only one that always loved and cared for Shirou, so that's a total win.
Lenin said: Aaaaawwwwww!!! I wonder why there are some people who hate this couple
Because a lot of people (like Knave here) fail completely and utterly to understand Sakura, why she's like she is or the fact that she bears essentially no responsibility for the events of HF.
kokubunji said: Because they're heartless bastards :)
Yeah, exactly....
Kotonoha said: Well, the girl who's only been coming around to make his breakfast for one year clearly doesn't fit that description.
Guess that means Shirou's true love is Taiga!
I don't think Taiga fits somehow....
Sakura, OTOH, looks after Shirou, cooks for him, cleans his house, helps him when he's sick and loves him deeply. She *deserves* to be with him, and she *needs* to be with him.
I love how butthurt everyone is over their precious ideal housewife not being the favourite. Personally, I'm not inclined to hold HF against her, as that's just plain unreasonable, but on the flip side, I really don't reserve much respect for a paper-thin 'good wife' stereotype. She's a doormat. I like women with backbones.
Seriously, look on it the other way. Sakura and situation was the only method which finally can cure Shirou and his self-destructive personality. It sounds weird when Shirou risked the most and got closest to death in HF(Well, one of the ending even have him die). Despite that my statement holds. He learned to make priorities and save the people close to him first and prevent him eventually getting disillusioned thus turning into someone like Kiritsugu or Archer. Also Shirou learned to rely on others. Not because they would come along anyways but he truly realized that his power alone isn't always enough.
After HF Shirou still aims to be a hero but he learned to take care of himself and see some self-worth, if for nothing else but for Sakura the very least. The other heroines were strong but that's exactly why they won't help Shirou and he would always hold his burden.
willyvereb said: After HF Shirou still aims to be a hero but he learned to take care of himself and see some self-worth, if for nothing else but for Sakura the very least. The other heroines were strong but that's exactly why they won't help Shirou and he would always hold his burden.
I agree with you on Saber's route. But i disagree on Rin being "strong". Rin had alot of Self-doubt just like Sakura. Saber was the only one with enough Self-Esteem to keep going. Actually, Saber was so confident that Shirou pretty much had to spend the entire route telling Saber to "Take it easy".
Tetsamaru said: Saber was the only one with enough Self-Esteem to keep going. Actually, Saber was so confident that Shirou pretty much had to spend the entire route telling Saber to "Take it easy".
Saber was so confident that after saving her country for ten years and inspiring the legend of the Great King Arthur, she decided she wasn't good enough and should immediately unmake her entire life's work.
Servants are similar to the Masters that summon them. Like Shirou, Saber likely has no sense of self.
Perhaps i should have said that Saber had more "Balls" than Rin and Sakura. Also, how the heck is Archer similar to Rin? I see no connection other than the Spoilerific reason. While in Sakura's case, its actually pointed out that Rider and her are the same personality wise.
Fluffz0rs said: I love how butthurt everyone is over their precious ideal housewife not being the favourite. Personally, I'm not inclined to hold HF against her, as that's just plain unreasonable, but on the flip side, I really don't reserve much respect for a paper-thin 'good wife' stereotype. She's a doormat. I like women with backbones.
There's plenty to respect in Sakura's character if you look at what she's been through and note that she didn't break until she started to get what she wanted. Ten years of horrific abuse, ten years she takes it like a champ, and ten years she keeps on smiling like nothing happened, and did it convincingly enough that even her closest friends never noticed that anything was wrong.
Yes she's a submissive doormat and yes she's the most damsel-like "heroine" in the series but the girl's got serious intestinal fortitude. If Shirou hadn't noticed her and started to care about her as more than a friend, she would've kept right on going with her normal routine for the foreseeable future. The only reason she finally broke down is because Shirou gave her what she wanted and then Shinji threatened to take it away.
Tetsamaru said: how the heck is Archer similar to Rin?
Archer is as much of a smartass as Rin. He willingly does the dirty jobs that needs doing, similarly to Rin. He does/did that out of a sense of duty, as Rin is motivated by duty to her late father. His favourite color is red, as is Rin's. They both put on a tough attitude and criticise a lot, but does it to help others improve themselves. Rin also does it to hide her insecurities, but give her the lifetime of Archer and that should likely change.
Fluffz0rs said: I love how butthurt everyone is over their precious ideal housewife not being the favourite. Personally, I'm not inclined to hold HF against her, as that's just plain unreasonable, but on the flip side, I really don't reserve much respect for a paper-thin 'good wife' stereotype. She's a doormat. I like women with backbones.
I don't like her because she's an 'ideal housewife', I like her because of what is beneath that (entirely fake) layer. Sakura is actually not a doormat, or an ideal housewife, at least not naturally. The reason she appears to be a doormat in FSN is because she is ''broken'', and because she doesn't actually have a ''choice''. Zouken doesn't allow her to do anything other than meekly obey his instructions, and if she does, he tortures her for disobedience. Even despite that, she ''still'' stands up to him and refuses to fight in the Grail War, despite fully expecting to be thrown to the worms as punishment.
As for the housewife thing, that entirely comes from her interactions with Shirou (who is an 'ideal housewife' type, except that he's also extremely badass), coupled with the fact that she's generally a kind, helpful person. She doesn't enjoy cooking, she enjoys cooking with/for Shirou. Prior to coming around his house, she didn't even know how to cook.
Sakura acts like a doormat because she never had any other option. At the age she was sent to the Matou family, there was simply no way for her to fight or resist them, and to do so would have just broken her entirely. The only was she could keep any semblance of her sanity was if she meekly obeyed Zouken's instructions until she actually had something she could fight for. Also, she lacks any sense of self-worth (because prior to Shirou no-one has ever shown any indication of actually caring for her (except for Kariya, and even then she never know how much he cared)). Her mother and father abandoned her to a life of hell, her sister (seemingly) forgot about her, her grandfather and adoptive father treated her like a tool and abused her and her adoptive brother abused, raped and belittled her constantly.
Normally I don't like the 'ideal housewife' characters (I don't like Rin/Sakura's mother, Aoi, one bit, for instance, because she failed utterly to stand up for her daughter), but Sakura doesn't really fit that mould, at least not normally. She's an abused child who, by all rights, should be far worse than she is, but because she possesses so much mental strength, she is able to bounce back from the abuse and, given the right circumstances, live a full and happy life. Also, HA shows that, freed from Zouken's control, she becomes a lot more assertive (she's basically like a kinder, less Tsundere version of Rin), which proves my point further.
As for her feelings for Shirou, and her absolute reliance on him, that isn't surprising, given that he's the only person in ten years to show her any real affection or kindness. He's the only person who can allow her to feel happiness, and so she needs him to allow her to become stronger and to be able to be happy in her life more generally.
Tetsamaru said: Also, how the heck is Archer similar to Rin? I see no connection other than the Spoilerific reason. While in Sakura's case, its actually pointed out that Rider and her are the same personality wise.
He's not really. The only connection is the pendant. There are two ways to summon a servant. You can either use a catalyst (which is what Rin did, albeit accidentally) or you can just summon a servant without one, in which case you get a personality match (hence Rider and Sakura). Since Archer was summoned with a catalyst (the pendant), there isn't any reason why they should have a personality match.
lolin86 said: Woah there buddy, as far I know, if they get raped it does not make them sluts, it makes them victims
Yes....
I was arguing that she wasn't a slut, hence my comment (note that being raped neither makes you a slut nor prevents you from being one, so that's not an argument either way). The comment you want is the one above mine....
