Moderation changes

There's something like 40 images waiting to be deleted including ones flagged. I think there may be a hiccup in the maintenance script.

In the mod queue, you can show the users of the queue that you dislike or feel that a post does not meet the criteria for Danbooru by having it hidden. Would it it be possible to create a short list and show other janitors/mods/admins that you like a post and are considering approving it or something along those lines? Sometimes its easier to make a decision when you know the positive as well as the negative.

While there are a lot of interesting ideas being thrown about, with some merit, I'm just going to come out and say it: I'd never use them. The queue takes long enough to look at simply with clicking approve or deny. Leaving reasons for other mods or deciding between "no" and "hell no" and all that other stuff would add too much time to the process for me.

Not saying they couldn't be implemented, if they were optional, though.

I'd like to support the motion for "hell no" option, but in a slightly modified form: there should be option to delete a picture, but leave it in the uploader's slot until it expires. I don't usually kill images even if they make me gouge my eyes out, because it means the uploader will have one more slot to fill with trash instantly. Thus having the ability to delete things but without freeing up the slot would be greatly appreciated in removing the worst shit.

Flat-out deletion should probably work that way anyway, since it's almost always for ToS violations where we don't want to reward the uploader with more slots.

I don't think we should start promoting the idea of flat-out deleting everything we wouldn't ourselves approve though, since that defeats the entire reason for the "hide" feature and 3-day auto-delete in the first place.

I don't mean deleting things I wouldn't approve. I mean deleting things where I want to be absolutely sure everyone gets the idea that I really *don't* want it to be approved.

As for whether it should be the default, I guess yes, but I would like to retain the ability to request a deletion with the slot being freed up. It's not uncommon that I get deletion requests after people upload things by mistake.

Yeah, I get those too occasionally. An override isn't a bad idea, but losing a slot probably isn't the end of the world even in that case, since they regenerate.

Of course, but what I want to avoid is the situation where somebody posts a burst of shit, I delete it, and they get rewarded with more upload slots immediately available (because they disappear slower than 1 per 1 deleted posts).

葉月 said:
I don't mean deleting things I wouldn't approve. I mean deleting things where I want to be absolutely sure everyone gets the idea that I really *don't* want it to be approved.

I understand not approving stuff you don't like, but is deleting stuff in order to let others know you don't want them to be approved OK? (provided they're not ToS violations of course)

I'm only bringing this up because of stuff like post #562852. I don't like that post, but it was just kinda weird seeing it getting approved, then deleted (I guess it was you) and then approved again by Albert himself. Same deal regarding the recent little derail with jxh in the appeals thread about post #559811, or the whole debate about post #574061.

I'm not crazy about either three (I only appealed post #559811 because it was a complete version of existing posts) and I'm not taking any sides, or saying how such things must be handled, because I don't know. It just seems to me that there must be some issue here that needs to be worked out if the top people in Danbooru handle things so differently.

I'm speaking mostly about things like post #540806 or post #392682. While I do think post #562852 is really bad, it's still considerably far from the rock bottom.

I'd like to stress there is a continuum of things I wouldn't approve. From post #559811, which I wouldn't approve on its own (but would as the complete parent), yet wouldn't oppose heavily; it just happened to be picked as an example in the middle of another discussion. Through post #562852, which I would and did actively delete, but am not gonna fight about. To post #392682, which if you had approved, I'd make sure to do many nasty things to you. The above proposal was meant for things to the right of post #562852, where I really want to signal that I oppose having it here at all.

And there isn't really all that much fighting going on. It's true that I happened to be in several heated discussions about whether things stay in the past week, but it's the first time anything like that happens ever since I've been a mod. Previously I'd had maybe two, three disputable cases in total.

I'd have to vote against the idea of implementing anything that expands deletion of things in the queue that aren't TOS violations.

It's true there's not a lot of infighting going on but the whole post #559811 vs post #574061 issue concerns me enough that I very much don't want mods deleting anything that isn't against the TOS, if it's still in the queue. It shows that there's an at times stark difference in opinion of what is danbooru quality even among the small number of active approvers we have (which is part of why I was worried about it being opened to 200+ more).

I honestly can't see the benefits from choosing new janitors this way. We already have a few that could/should be demoted (see Disland ( post #344957 )), this way we will just have even more work to do by checking how the new ones are doing. The best thing would be having existing janitors and mods nominate known contributors, or at least letting us say "no, this one is bad" and see if others agree and stuff.
So, could a "private section" be made to dicuss about this stuff or something?

Snesso said: We already have a few that could/should be demoted (see Disland ( post #344957 ))

And numerous others that are almost as bad. Not even an active user of the site anymore, it would seem. Demoted.

I think the mods should base what they approve on whether or not they think Albert would approve it. The stuff 葉月 complains about being awful and shitty are often the same quality as the stuff albert uploads.

And I think I share the same standard with albert. I don't think every single image should be absolutely mindblowing for it to fit on db. Just not bad...not having to wade through a thousand pages of mspaint, 4chan memes, off-topic, or generally bad images.

abcadeff said:
I think the mods should base what they approve on whether or not they think Albert would approve it. The stuff 葉月 complains about being awful and shitty are often the same quality as the stuff albert uploads.

I don't agree, I think the mods should approve only what they like. I do agree with jxh though, they shouldn't delete stuff simply because they don't like them.

I see the queue as more of a filter for things I would have posted myself if I had found them first, for the most part. I may question why someone else approved something to myself but if it's at least the quality of something albert himself would have posted I won't do anything more than that.

abcadeff said:
I think the mods should base what they approve on whether or not they think Albert would approve it. The stuff 葉月 complains about being awful and shitty are often the same quality as the stuff albert uploads.

And I think I share the same standard with albert. I don't think every single image should be absolutely mindblowing for it to fit on db. Just not bad...not having to wade through a thousand pages of mspaint, 4chan memes, off-topic, or generally bad images.

I agree with this. I don't really like explicit stuff but if I see something that is generally accepted and uploaded by janitors/contributors and people who we can all trust their judgment then I'd approve it based on that as well as technical quality (Line art, color, anatomy, relevance to japanese culture etc). I try not to let gut reactions and bias play into what I approve.

We are explicitly told only to accept things we personally like. This is good because it's something we can instictually do. It is speculative and meaningless to ask us to approve things we would have liked had we been one of the other contributor+ people who happened to post similar things.

If a janitor or above posts similar things and likes what he sees in the queue, it will be approved by them. It's not necessary for the others to approve it on behalf of that person.

Shinjidude said:
We are explicitly told only to accept things we personally like. This is good because it's something we can instictually do. It is speculative and meaningless to ask us to approve things we would have liked had we been one of the other contributor+ people who happened to post similar things.

So, "is this picture good" then, instead of "is this picture bad". That does make tackling that monster mod queue easier, doesn't it. I got stuck during the hour of power because of the latter; too many images I didn't especially like that I couldn't justify allowing to be deleted either.

abcadeff said: I think the mods should base what they approve on whether or not they think Albert would approve it.

That is not only silly, it's nearly impossible to implement. I'm not albert, I can't think exactly the same way he does. And nobody, even albert, is going to be completely consistent even in their own tastes.

RaisingK said: So, "is this picture good" then, instead of "is this picture bad".

That's how I try to go about it, yes.